On C/C++ undefined behaviours (there is no "Eclipse")

[retard]

Tue, 05 Oct 2010 15:49:59 +0100, Bruno Medeiros wrote:

> On 02/10/2010 15:13, retard wrote:
>> Fri, 01 Oct 2010 14:53:04 +0100, Bruno Medeiros wrote:
>>
>>> On 20/08/2010 22:37, Nick Sabalausky wrote:
>>>> "retard"<re at tard.com.invalid>   wrote in message
>>>> news:i4mrss$cam$1 at digitalmars.com...
>>>>> Fri, 20 Aug 2010 19:04:41 +0200, Andrej Mitrovic wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> What are these Java programs for the desktop that run fast? I
>>>>>> haven't encountered any, but maybe that's just because I didn't try
>>>>>> them all out. Eclipse takes at least 20 seconds to load on startup
>>>>>> on my quad core, that's not very fast. On the other hand,
>>>>>> CodeBlocks which is coded in C++ and has  a few dozen plugins
>>>>>> installed runs in an instant.
>>>>>
>>>>> Now that's a fair comparison! "Crysis runs so slowly but a hello
>>>>> world written in Go is SO fast. This must prove that Go is much
>>>>> faster than C+ +!"
>>>>>
>>>>> I think CodeBlocks is one of the most lightweight IDEs out there.
>>>>> Does it even have full semantic autocompletion? Eclipse, on the
>>>>> other hand, comes with almost everything you can imagine. If you
>>>>> turn off the syntax check, Eclipse works just as fast as any native
>>>>> application on a modern desktop.
>>>>
>>>> I've tried eclipse with the fancy stuff off, and it's still slower
>>>> than C::B or PN2 for me.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>> All these comments about Eclipse takes this time to load, or Eclipse
>>> is slow when used, etc., are really meaningless unless you tell us
>>> something about what actual plugins and features are installed and
>>> used.
>>>
>>> Unlike CodeBlocks which is "a free C++ IDE", Eclipse proper is the
>>> Eclipse Platform, which is a platform (duh) and doesn't do anything
>>> useful by itself. Particularly since there is not even a
>>> standard/single "Eclipse" download: http://www.eclipse.org/downloads/
>>> , unlike Codeblocks. The days were JDT would be the main thing 95% of
>>> Eclipse users would use are long gone.
>>>
>>> So are you using JDT, CDT, Descent, something else? If JDT, do you
>>> have extra tools, like the J2EE Web Tools? (these add massive bloat)
>>> What about source control plugins, or plugins not provided by the
>>> Eclipse Foundation, etc? All of these are a wildcard that can affect
>>> performance. For example, I definitely note that sometimes my
>>> workspace chokes when I do certain SVN or file related operations
>>> (with Subclipse btw, not Subversive).
>>> I also noted, when Eclipse 3.6 came out, some sluggishness when
>>> working with JDT, even when just typing code (in this case it was very
>>> subtle, almost imperceptible, but I still felt it and it was quite
>>> annoying). I suspected not JDT, but Mylyn, so I uninstalled it, and
>>> now things are back to normal. (there might be a fix or workaround for
>>> that issue in Mylyn, but since I don't use it, I didn't bother)
>>>
>>> I would definitely be quite annoying if Eclipse was not responsive for
>>> the vast majority of coding tasks.
>>>
>>> As for startup time, I hardly care anything about that :
>>> http://www.digitalmars.com/d/archives/digitalmars/D/
>> 
Re_Eclipse_startup_time_Was_questions_on_PhanTango_merger_was_Merging_Tangobos_into_Tango_60160.html#N60346
>>> (except when I'm doing PDE development, but that's a different thing)
>>
>> Back then the unhappy user was using a 1 GHz Pentium M notebook. I
>> tried this again. Guess what, the latest Eclipse Helios (3.6.1) took
>> 3.5 (!!!) seconds to start up the whole Java workspace, open few
>> projects and fully initialize the editors etc for the most active
>> project. Has the original complainer ever used Photoshop, CorelDraw,
>> AutoCad, Maya/3DSMax, Maple/ MathCad/Mathematica, or some other Real
>> World Programs (tm)? These are all fucking slow. That's how it is: If
>> you need to get the job done, you must use slow programs.
>>
>>
> I'm sure that the people who downright refuse to use Eclipse because it
> loads too slow use some other program for media development. Maybe its
> MS Paint (or a Linux equivalent) because it loads so fast! Or maybe its
> a vi/emacs plugin for image manipulation or 3D modelling. ;)

Well Don mentioned that he had used ALL of those programs and since no 
complaints about the slow loading times of those programs were mentioned, 
I assume all of them (the latest versions, of course) start in less than 
3.5 seconds. I pondered this a bit and am now willing to buy Don's magic 
computer. I really do have need for a laptop that can launch those 
applications in less than 3.5 seconds.