Weak Eco System?

[Basile B. via Digitalmars-d]

On Wednesday, 17 May 2017 at 08:19:43 UTC, Benro wrote:
> On Tuesday, 16 May 2017 at 23:17:10 UTC, Mike B Johnson wrote:
>>
>> Grow up!!!!!
>>
>> ! is not yelling. It makes no sound, has no meaning, and only 
>> exists to insert in to tight anuses that have no life.
>
> Thank you for your helpful comment.
>
> I wonder if the inability for D community to grow is not more 
> related to the fairly noticeable arrogant attitude of its 
> members.
>
> One only need to read past messages on this forum to see the 
> exact same issue over and over again. People mention issues and 
> the standard response: "Why do you not do x" or act with a 
> sense of superiority.
>
> Maybe too many people have been D member too long but its 
> obvious that there are too many steps for new users to use D, 
> unlike with other new languages.
>
> D as a language is fairly feature complete. But everything 
> around it just screams "skipped leg day".
>
> Lets see with other languages?
>
> Go: Full working IDEs where things just work out of the box.
>
> ** IntelliJ: You can simply get Gogland and it works great.
> ** VSC: vscode-go work perfectly.
>
> Rust:
>
> ** IntelliJ: intellij-rust plugin works great, few steps 
> required.
> ** VSC: vscode-rust ...
>
> I am using these languages because they are young languages. 
> Despite that they outrun D on several fronts.
>
> It takes me 10 minutes in other languages to get a full working 
> IDE with lots of Editor/IDE choices. It takes time, hours of 
> reading, compiling, configuring to try and get a full working 
> IDE on D. And no, color syntax does not count.
>
> I do not want to disparage the D plugin authors but one only 
> needs to see the update history of all the D, Go, Rust, ... 
> plugins to see the difference in activity. There is a lack of 
> passion. Maybe its just my impression but this language seems 
> to be support really by maybe a dozen people at best. What 
> happens if Walter and Andrei call it quits? Or god forbids 
> anything happens to them.
>
>
> I do not know about you but posting a point of criticism in the 
> other communities does not result in such drama. Maybe people 
> have gotten too sensitive and desperate for protecting the 
> language that criticism is considered bad.
>
> But you think that responses like "if you would have took the 
> time to report it!". No ... when i report issues in the other 
> languages, nobody acts like that. Even if it was a 
> misunderstanding, i notice people jumping on each other here 
> WAY too much in previous posts.
>
> Let me mention how a few other languages do things:
>
> Predictable release schedules: Rust every 6 weeks a release. Go 
> six month release a release. D? Whenever?

D release cycle is not so bad. I also program in Object Pascal: 
FPC has one release every 2 years...There's better, there's 
worst. The schedule is sometimes broken but it's because of the 
dot releases which fix regressions. At least they are handled and 
not ignored just to respect a release date.

> Plugin support: Well, see above. Even the Google able 
> Editor/IDE wiki page is out of date ( 
> https://wiki.dlang.org/IDEs, https://wiki.dlang.org/Editors ). 
> From my understanding there are about 4 or 5 plugin/editors 
> that have some life in them. All the rest seems abandoned. 
> Inviting is it not?
>
> Community: Outside this forum almost non existing unless you 
> consider reddit/programming. Where other languages have active 
> communities outside there main side / forum.

You're welcome in D IRC channel. It's very active, very friendly, 
less formal than the forum, more immediate. There are channels 
with way more users but almost no public conversations.

> Proposals: DIP how many gave gotten accepted, that are NOT part 
> of the main developers like Walter and Andrei. Most seem to 
> turn into a slugfests for ages and they slowly die. Other 
> languages seems to have a much more inviting attitude towards 
> proposals.
>
> Tooling: Split, manual compile jobs, not part of the main 
> installation.
>
> dmd, rdmd why do they even exist in this wat? rdmd needs to be 
> default. Nothing more fun as trying to get a module to run, 
> getting a cryptic message only to find out you need to use rdmd 
> or use dmd with flags link to it. What are we 1980's?
>
> Even the default dmd info is too much. User friendly it is not. 
> The advanced information needs to be behind a flag, not dumped 
> onto a user his screen.
>
> It feels like C++ software from the 80s that assumes that ever 
> user can spend a few hours reading / understanding each flag.
>
>
> How about focusing on one compiler instead of splitting your 
> community in three. Its a wast of resources. There is a clear 
> lack of people to support the language and this attitude of 
> running people off. Great idea <sarcasm>.
>

The 3 compilers use the same front-end. Lexing, parsing, semantic 
are common.

> Its no wonder that Go, Rust simply jumped over D. Its not about 
> corporate backers, its about how the community is build up.
>
>
> I can go on but it feels like trowing words at a wall. There 
> are a LOT of issues that are obvious for any outsider to see 
> after a short amount of time.
>
>
> Deal with these comments how you like. Maybe you think i am 
> trolling but that make me the most stupid Troll to wast so much 
> time writing this.
>
> Frankly, i like the D language but there is a instant dislike 
> to this community. Like most people i do not have the time to 
> deal with drama. This is my last attempt at going with D. Good 
> day to you Sir!

While being angry remove the barrier of the politeness and allows 
a certain frankness, you should calm down. After all it's only 
about a misunderstanding initiated by an exclamation mark. Well, 
i think this thread is dead but don't give up for all that, these 
kind of conversation happen several times per year, it's not that 
a problem for me...life is so.